Government Orders

Bill C-11, Military Justice System Modernization Act · Report stage · now law Where it stands

What the law does

The law removes the military's authority to investigate or try sexual offences under the Criminal Code that are alleged to have taken place in Canada. It alters appointment processes for military prosecutors, defence counsel, and the provost marshal, who is renamed the Provost Marshal General. The law also expands who can become a military judge, removes those judges from the summary hearing system, and lets people acting for victims request a liaison officer.

Official text (opens in a new tab)

15 statements

Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Lac-Saint-Jean

Bloc Québécois
“If my colleague could make just one change to this bill right away, what would it be?”
Official Hansard

Mr. Speaker, I really enjoyed my colleague’s speech. My question is quite simple. If it were possible to make just one amendment to this bill, is there a particularly important one that my colleague would want to immediately make to the bill? If so, what is it?

Simon-Pierre Savard-Tremblay, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot—Acton

Bloc Québécois
“The committee worked for weeks and voted for changes to this bill. Now the government is trying to undo our changes. I want to know what the member thinks about the government ignoring the committee's work.”
Official Hansard

Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask my colleague a question. By the way, I hold her in high regard, but my question has nothing to do with that. How does she feel about the fact that, for weeks, we have been doing our committee work and now, when the majority of committee members have worked to get amendments adopted, the government is doing everything it can to undo what has been done? Is this not a slap in the face to democracy? Has the majority gone to the Liberals’ heads?

Simon-Pierre Savard-Tremblay, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot—Acton

Bloc Québécois
“Victims of misconduct in the military have waited years for justice. The committee listened to victims and experts and changed this bill to make it better. Now the government is trying to erase all that work. That ignores the victims and weakens democracy.”
Official Hansard

Mr. Speaker, there are many stories in this whole sad affair. Some of them involve tragic misconduct and victims left with the aftereffects. There is the story, which spanned many years, of continued impunity, as people were protected by successive governments. Then came the bungling and the never-ending delays. Finally, our very democracy plays a part in all this, as well. First and foremost, it is the story of victims of misconduct. Members will recall the whole story, which has been told many times in the House, of General Vance, who was protected by successive ministers of governments of all political stripes. This general was able to live with impunity, bragging that he would be forever protected and untouchable at all times because he had control over the military justice system. Members will recall that it took a long time for this story to come to light, and when it did, many said that silence was the best response—that eternal guilty silence that keeps victims voiceless. It is also the story of several commissions of inquiry. I am thinking of Justice Arbour and Justice Fish. Several commissions of inquiry came to a number of conclusions after thousands of people were interviewed. There were thousands of testimonies; thousands of voices were heard in the context of this tragic case. This is an issue that has since dragged on for more than 15 years. It took more than 15 years to come up with the first version of a bill in the last Parliament and, in the current Parliament, the bill now before us. This is a matter of democracy. I believe that, as members of Parliament, we are being shortchanged, and democracy is being shortchanged, by what is happening right now. Allow me to digress for a moment because this is important. Let us not forget that this is also the story of a government that called an election last year. What was the outcome of that election? It resulted in a minority government. That means that we go before the voters, present them with options and ideas, and show them where we are headed and what we are proposing. That is where democracy decides. It decides by determining which idea has majority support. In other words, there were more votes and more seats for the current government’s proposal, but there are still enough voters who said they did not agree. The result is that the government in power has a majority that is not absolute. It is a simple majority, but one that is not absolute in terms of the number of seats. That was the verdict in April 2025. The message to the government is to work with the other parties, because more people chose the other options combined. If my math is correct, that is what it comes down to. I am no fan of the Canadian parliamentary system, but it seems to me that, in the history of these highly imperfect institutions, that is just how it works. That is the result. That is what it amounts to. Let us come back to the story of this government that introduced Bill C-11 and the opposition parties who voted in favour of the principle of the bill because everyone agreed with it and action needed to be taken. People have suffered and others will continue to suffer if nothing changes. After the opposition parties acted in good faith and the House adopted the bill in principle, it was the committee’s turn to patiently do its work. For several weeks, it heard from witnesses and reviewed reports and briefs, including one from the Barreau du Québec, which said that it liked the idea of the bill but that some small changes needed to be made. We also heard from a number of victims and victims’ associations, who made recommendations and told us that, when cases are being transferred, the military justice option needs to remain open. Even though transferring cases to the civilian system is generally a good thing, we still need to have some sort of military system for certain cases, so we should not close the door on that completely. That was the subject of an amendment that was deemed admissible, and I am happy about that because we are the ones who proposed that amendment. The Conservative amendment regarding complete freedom of choice was deemed inadmissible recently, even though it was also adopted in committee. Our amendment does not propose complete freedom of choice, but it says that if experts in the civilian system recommend keeping the case in the military system, then that might be a good thing for some victims. It worked, and I am very pleased about that. This is an example of a recommendation made by the Barreau du Québec, which ultimately concluded that Bill C-11, as it stood, was unsatisfactory, even though it was well-intentioned. A whole host of other recommendations like that were also adopted by way of amendments, often with the majority support of the two opposition parties. Some amendments were adopted unanimously with the support of the Liberal Party, but, for the most part, it was the opposition parties that joined forces and managed to gain the upper hand. I am pleased that we managed to achieve this. It was democracy at work. In our committee, the majority consisted of opposition MPs. I would remind members that we patiently listened to victims, experts, the Barreau du Québec and other stakeholders who came to tell us what they believed should be done. Some of the recommendations in the Fish report were even subsequently deemed inadmissible. That report, which remains something of an authoritative reference on the subject, was deemed inadmissible—that says it all. It is also the story of a government that secured a majority by getting opposition members to switch sides, swearing up and down that its approach would be collaborative. In the days that followed, however, one of the first things they told us was that they plan to unilaterally change committee composition without even talking to the opposition parties. That is what collaboration, co-operation and working together in the House mean to them. It is also the story of a government that then attempts to throw out all the work that committees have been doing for weeks, along with the democratic decisions of parliamentarians who voted on committee business. This is the story of a committee chair who decided amendments were out of order. We overruled his decision with a majority vote in committee, but he got his way in the end. It is also the story of a Speaker of the House who heard my appeal and that of my colleague, the Conservative Party’s defence critic, who rose in the House to say that we heard the victims, that we could not ignore them and that certain recommendations could not be ruled out of order. From a procedural standpoint, for example, our proposal to consider establishing an office did not entail the allocation of additional resources, yet it was deemed inadmissible on the grounds that it required additional resources. Our proposal does not run counter to the intent of this bill, which aims to reform military justice to make life more bearable for victims and to better address cases of misconduct. I am sorry, but when we have good ideas to improve a bill and flesh it out, that aligns with the bill’s intent. In our case, given that we are stuck with this highly imperfect Canadian parliamentary system, we have decided, procedurally speaking, to include in the bill the need to consider establishing an office. This does not mean creating the office itself or adding new resources. It costs nothing to mandate the government to look into the issue. It does not cost a penny to include it in the bill. However, the Speaker decided to reject all of those amendments. Even though a few admissible amendments remained, we found out only yesterday evening after checking the Notice Paper that the government had rejected them in a last-ditch effort—like I said, their majority is going to their heads—to erase, destroy, undo and dismantle everything that members had accomplished in committee. What a slap in the face for the experts, the victims and democracy.

Simon-Pierre Savard-Tremblay, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot—Acton

Bloc Québécois
“My amendment does not give people total freedom of choice. It means not every case must be moved automatically. We would usually move them to civilian courts, but experts could choose to keep a case in the military system if that is best.”
Official Hansard

Mr. Speaker, it never ceases to amaze me how my colleague opposite never listens. He gets up, walks around, talks and then asks a question that I already answered in my speech. We have come to expect it. As I said, this is not about complete freedom of choice. The amendment known as BQ‑2 did not involve complete freedom of choice. What the amendment said is that not every case needs to be automatically transferred. Our initial response would be to transfer these cases, but if experts and the civilian system consider it advisable to keep them in the military system, that would be allowed. That is all. I will close by saying that Justice Arbour could have come and testified, as she was also invited to do.

Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Lac-Saint-Jean

Bloc Québécois
“A House committee spent public money and many hours studying an important report. They listened to experts and victims. Now the government is completely ignoring that work. I want to ask my colleague what he thinks this says about the government's respect for democracy.”
Official Hansard

Mr. Speaker, the Prime Minister keeps saying that he wants to manage public finances in a wiser, more rigorous way. A House of Commons committee spent hours studying an extremely important report. The committee heard from experts and victims. Members of Parliament and their staff, as well as the committee staff, examined the matter during several meetings. Public funds were used for the benefit of parliamentary democracy. Now we are learning that the government is completely ignoring all the work that was done. This government is not looking at it at all. I would like my colleague to comment on the frustration this caused him. What does he think this all means? What does all this show about the government’s understanding of parliamentary democracy?

Simon-Pierre Savard-Tremblay, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot—Acton

Bloc Québécois
“The government knows how Parliament works, but it does not care. It is using tricks to ignore the rights of members of Parliament and the victims who came to speak.”
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Official Hansard

Mr. Speaker, it shows that the government understands perfectly well how things work, but that it could not care less. In other words, it knows exactly what tactics to use to trample on the rights of members of Parliament, and in this particular case, to show utter contempt for the victims who appeared in order to have their say. That is what all this tells us.

Simon-Pierre Savard-Tremblay, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot—Acton

Bloc Québécois
“Victims and legal experts told us that not all military cases should go to civilian courts. My party proposed a change that lets civilian experts decide which cases stay in the military justice system. What does the member have to say to the victims who asked for this?”
Official Hansard

Mr. Speaker, I would answer the question with a question. I am going to do what the Liberals do during question period and answer with a question. Someday it will be their turn to ask questions in the House, because nothing lasts forever. What does my colleague have to say to the victims, the victims’ associations, the Barreau du Québec and the experts who told us that they were in favour of allowing cases to be transferred to the civilian justice system, but not at all costs? It may be suitable for some cases, but not all. I understand that complete freedom of choice is not necessarily the right option for the sole reason that not everyone always has the information and there can still be things like manipulation behind the scenes. We agree on that. However, BQ‑2, which was adopted by a majority of parliamentarians on the committee, would have made it possible to determine, on the recommendation of civilian court experts, that certain matters were best left to the military justice ssytem. What does my colleague have to say to the victims who came to testify?

Simon-Pierre Savard-Tremblay, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot—Acton

Bloc Québécois
“The Liberals are acting arrogant because they have a majority. They are ignoring all the work we did listening to victims. I want to see how the member for Nunavut votes, because she used to support these ideas before she joined the Liberals.”
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Official Hansard

Mr. Speaker, I would also like to thank my colleague. We worked very well together on this. I think this just goes to show that the Liberals’ majority has gone to their heads. They are going to be extremely arrogant in the coming years. The next three and a half years are going to feel very long and drawn out, but the public will judge for themselves. The proof will be in the pudding. This shows that the Liberals do not care about what we heard or about the weeks and weeks of work we did listening to what victims had to say. That is extremely frustrating, but I am still interested in seeing how the member for Nunavut, a former NDP member, will vote, because she made several recommendations when she came to committee. Now, she is a Liberal, so I am interested to see how she will vote.

Simon-Pierre Savard-Tremblay, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot—Acton

Bloc Québécois
“The parliamentary secretary should stop using victims to score political points. The Liberals have already shown that they do not care, and he should stop pretending to be upset.”
Official Hansard

Mr. Speaker, the parliamentary secretary should stop engaging in demagoguery at the expense of victims, since the Liberals were the ones who showed that they did not care. He should stop pretending to be upset when we know that is not true.

Simon-Pierre Savard-Tremblay, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot—Acton

Bloc Québécois
“In committee, I asked us to study Quebec's model of a special court for misconduct. The Liberals wasted time and blocked the whole meeting so we could not talk about it.”
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Official Hansard

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague, aside from him saying shame on me. It is okay, I will sleep soundly, better than he will, I suspect. Let us forget the principle of the amendments. In his last response, the member asked our colleague to listen to what was said at the standing committee. I thought that was funny, because I was there but he was not. He was in the House, as usual. He probably spends Christmas here. That said, something that came up often was the Quebec model of a specialized court to deal with misconduct. I moved a motion that was unrelated to the bill but that asked whether, in the long term, we could consider this, look at it and assess this option. The Liberals filibustered for the entire meeting. Is that how they feel about institutions?

Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Lac-Saint-Jean

Bloc Québécois
“The Liberals claim that committee work is important. Yet they ignore the work done by members from all parties and the witnesses who testified. I want to know what my colleague thinks about how the Liberals treat our committees and our democracy.”
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Official Hansard

Mr. Speaker, in a response he gave earlier to my colleague from Saint‑Hyacinthe—Bagot—Acton, the Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government said how important House of Commons committees are, going so far as to say that we can read everything that is said in committee because it is all on the committee’s web page and, as parliamentarians, we have access to all the work done by committees, even if we do not sit on them. I find it rather ironic that the parliamentary secretary is telling us how important parliamentary committees are when the Liberals do not even respect the work that was done by all the parliamentarians who were present, regardless of party, and by all the people who came to testify. I want to know what my colleague thinks of the Liberals’ conception of parliamentary democracy and committee work, especially as it relates to us today.

Xavier Barsalou-Duval, Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères

Bloc Québécois
“The committee worked hard on this bill, and other parties proposed good changes. Now the government is ignoring that work in the House. The government claims it wants to work together, but it does not, and I do not trust it to change.”
Official Hansard

Mr. Speaker, I congratulate my colleague on his speech. It is important to take an interest in what we are debating here in the House. While my colleague may take an interest in the debates here in the House, he is not, to my knowledge, a member of the committee that studied this bill. He can correct me if I am wrong. The committee members worked very hard on this. Bloc Québécois and Conservative members proposed amendments that came back to the House. It was not the first time that happened. I think we have seen that with other bills in the past. The government says it wants to collaborate, but it just dismisses the committee’s constructive work once the bill comes back to the House. This does not bode well for the future when the governing party has a majority in committees. Is this how it is going to be from now on, or will there be genuine collaboration? I have my doubts.

Jean-Denis Garon, Mirabel

Bloc Québécois
“Governments have ignored problems in the military justice system for years, despite many reports. Why have they cared so little? Also, why did the government reject our idea to let victims choose between military and regular courts?”
Official Hansard

Mr. Speaker, it is 2026. The first allegations against General Vance date back to 2015. At the time, rather than taking action, the Harper government gave him a promotion. Since then, we have had the Arbour, Deschamps and Fish reports, and yet here we are, still talking about this crisis in Canada’s military justice system. I have two questions. First, I would like to know why all the governments, and by that I mean the Harper government, the Trudeau government and today’s government, have shown so little concern for this issue. Second, in my colleague’s opinion, why did the government refuse to consider the Bloc Québécois’s amendment that sought to give victims a choice between the military and civilian justice systems in circumstances where these victims’ trust in the current military justice system may be undermined?

Xavier Barsalou-Duval, Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères

Bloc Québécois
“Opposition parties worked hard to improve this bill in committee. Now the Liberals are undoing all our changes. I want to know if the government plans to always ignore our work like this.”
Official Hansard

Mr. Speaker, earlier, I put a question to a member who I believe is sitting right next to my Liberal colleague. Since I did not get a complete answer, I will try asking her that same question. Members from my party, the Bloc Québécois, and members of the official opposition, the Conservatives, have worked hard on bills in committee on several occasions. We proposed amendments, worked in good faith, heard from witnesses and really did a thorough job. However, when those bills come back to the House, the Liberals just undo all that work and that is it. Is this indicative of how the government intends to manage its future majority?

Jean-Denis Garon, Mirabel

Bloc Québécois
“This bill ignores an important recommendation to let victims choose between military and civilian courts. The committee agreed to this change, but the government rejected it. The government is not taking victims' rights seriously.”
Official Hansard

Mr. Speaker, as I said earlier, the first allegations against General Vance came out in 2015. The Harper government gave him a promotion. This has been going on for over 10 years. It is now 2026. We got the reports from justices Arbour and Fish, and Justice Deschamps examined suggestions for legislative changes. However, in the bill before us today, the government has decided to ignore a major recommendation made by Justice Arbour, namely that a victim be given a choice between the military and civilian justice systems. When we asked the Liberals earlier why they ignored this amendment, which was not only discussed in good faith but also adopted by the committee, they simply replied that it is all well and good to work in good faith, but we cannot always get what we want. What does that say about what the government thinks of victims’ rights?

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